Reply To: Rational Suicide.

[Vicelin]

Nass said: -scrolls down-

WHOA! tl;dr!

But uh, don’t commit suicide. Cuz I read one time that if you die with regrets/ sadness, your spirit will keep reliving each memory until Armageddon

I don’t plan to kill myself >_>; I’m not suicidal. Because if the Hindus are right, then that means I’m stuck in samsara, and I’d really rather not be.

Pirkid said: You don’t know what death is.

Well, no. But neither do you. That’s the fun in it. No one is right, and no one is wrong.

Flamboyant authors and famous quotes state that death is a big adventure and should be embraced instead of avoided, but why?

Because accepting death as something positive instead of something terrible to be avoided at all costs will in general help someone to be less afraid when faced with the unknown. I used to get extremely depressed at the thought of what would happen to me when I die, and every time I was confronted with death I couldn’t handle it and I would have an emotional breakdown. When I accepted the concept of death not as an end, but instead a new beginning, I got over my fear and was able to lead a happier life. Accepting this idea doesn’t automatically mean that the person who accepts it is going to look for a way to end their life sooner. In my case, it just means that when it comes my time for a natural death, I won’t be scared. It just so happens that this idea is also shared by those who commit rational suicide, which is how I can sympathyze with it.

What’s wrong with your life that you want to change everything and move on to a place where you have no idea what happens? What if death is the most antagonizing event in our tangible lives? Would you be so eager as you RATIONALIZE a reason to die?

For the first question, that’s not one I can answer, because I’m not suicidal. I would love to ask someone who has commited rational suicide and find out in detail how they would answer that, but my little brother broke my Ouija board (sorry, that was a lame joke). Anyway.

As for the second question, there is really no way to know that, so I don’t have an opinion to offer.

I can’t believe this. You’re attaching a positive light to something we know nothing about, and never will.

Better then attaching negativity and fear to it, methinks.

Ghosts and paranormal activity, that’s all bullshit.

That’s a possibility, but there is no evidence to prove or disprove them, just like how there is no way to prove or disprove a God, because these things can’t be measured.

Atoms can change their stature at any moment, our world could implode with the collapse of molecules every nano-second. Death is not an ‘adventure’ or a ‘rational decision’, it’s an idiotic mistake.

I wonder if you’ve ever read about the EPR paradox. There are elements of the atom that are, much like the paranormal, a mystery in quantum mechanics.

As for what death is and isn’t, I think the idea that it’s an “idiotic mistake” is kind strange, but if you want to think of it that way and it puts you at ease, then go ahead.

Sure, if you know that it’s going to happen, by all means, jump off the highest cliff you can to experience it, or hang-glide into a tree, or ski down an avalanche. You’re gonna die sometime in the near future, do it with a bang, I can attest to that. Or if you want a quick, painless death, ask someone to help. But leading a healthy, active life, and deciding to destroy it?

Not everyone has the luxury of leading a healthy, happy, active life. Some people are born knowing how and when they are going to die because of an incurable disease. Some people are born into poverty or other unfavorable situations. Some people live their lives in physical pain that is barely manageable, but everyone around them expects them to stay alive and trapped in that pain until the very end, because a natural death is the only “good” death, and we selfishly want to keep them here as long as possible because when they do die, it will be be painful for US. Fear of death and appreciation of longevity are culturally embedded in our society, but that doesn’t mean we’re always right in our intentions.

While I’m listing examples, what about captured soldiers? If there is no means of escape and the choice is between letting the enemy torture you until you die or doing it quickly yourself, who has the right to tell them not to?

People die every two seconds without the will or power to stop it.

Sure, but think about what the world would be like if we DID have the power to stop death. The planet we live on would run out of natural resources, and while maybe longevity would increase, quality of life would dramatically decrease.

People around the world WANT TO LIVE, but they lack food, water, money, shelter. You treat your life like it’s worth nothing.

I understand the want to live, and I don’t think anything is wrong with that, but there is a point where when taken to extremes it becomes more harmful to society then good. My point is that I also understand the decision some to choose an early death, and that while I would not reach this conclusion myself, it’s not my decision nor anyone elses to make for them.

I never said that my life was worth nothing. I personally find life enjoyable and interesting, but not everyone lives a life like mine. As for the example you gave, I don’t see how it relates to the topic at all, but maybe I’m just confused. Like you said, lives can’t be traded or measured and distributed to people in the same way that food can, and wether suicide is the “wasting” of a life is totally subjective and not everyone will answer the same.

If you take it away ‘rationally’, you’re wasting what could have been someone else’s life.

Don’t be so foolish.

This makes absolutely no sense. “Life” isn’t something that can be simply given, there is no way to literally pass the one you have to someone else, so there really isn’t a way to “waste” it like that.

Anyway, I’d also like to post the response of a friend of mine. They wrote this for me when I brought up the topic, and I’m pretty terrible at putting my thoughts into words, so this might clear up what exactly my thoughts on suicide are:

I suspect some of the various taboos concerning suicide arise from our culture’s rather inadequate treatment of the reality of death, dying, and human mortality. We obsess over the appearances of youth by pressuring men and women always to look younger than they are instead of appreciating the aging process for what it is. We shut our elders away in nursing homes instead of giving them the position of honor and reverence that their wisdom deserves. Our funeral customs as well mask the face of death with beautifying dead bodies instead of showing what decay really looks like; preserving them in caskets instead of allowing them to rot and return to the Earth. In many ways I see society’s issues with suicide as symptomatic of this larger poorly painted treatment of death in general.

As with anything, though, I’d still have to say it depends on circumstances. I think most of us would say that a single father who has two young kids to be responsible for may be a bit more self-centered in killing himself than a widowed man with no dependents. In that case, relieving yourself from harm is causing great harm to those around you. That I have difficulty condoning. In other cases, it is almost self-centered to keep living. If you’re in a vegetative state and your loved ones are paying all those medical bills to keep you alive, you’re acting as a drain on their finances and their lives. Personally I would not want to burden my loved ones with such a thing; my ‘existence’ is doing them harm and it makes sense to end it.