[tarheel91]

Nass said:

tarheel91 said:

Nass said:

DarkDragoon said:

David said: Waaaaaaaaaaaay to go off the rails guys.

Somehow, we always manage to go off the rails.

ALWAYS.

Don’t be jocking on our swag dawg

Wow…

Before you flip out he wasn’t serious.

But still, who says JOCKING

People who are saying it ironically.

[tarheel91]

Nass said:

DarkDragoon said:

David said: Waaaaaaaaaaaay to go off the rails guys.

Somehow, we always manage to go off the rails.

ALWAYS.

Don’t be jocking on our swag dawg

Wow…

Before you flip out he wasn’t serious.

[tarheel91]

Spade said:

tarheel91 said:

Spade said:

tarheel91 said:

Spade said:

tarheel91 said:

Spade said:

tarheel91 said: I dunno, dude. Hackers and glitchers exist everywhere, and people are far more likely to have their consoles set up in a far worse place in terms of lag than their computer.

On top of that you’re giving up mouse + keyboard for dual analog? O_o

Trust me, I’m not pulling this out of my ass. The reason I’m switching is because I can actually SEE the difference from when I play at my PC to when I go play PS3 at my friend’s house. Also, I’ll be able to play with my friends more often; none of them are PC gamers.

And yeah, I know. Making the switch to dual analog really gave me the challenge, but it’s really not that bad once you get used to it. If you can get accustomed to a high sensitivity it gives a lot of potential when it comes to sniping and snapping to other people.

If not I can always get this.

I’m just saying, most people have their router set up near their computer while the console is sitting in the living room way away from it. I think the difference you’re seeing is because consoles usually restrict who you can connect to to those within your own country/region whereas on some PC games there’s no restriction on who can play who. Basically, if you’d try a game with dedicated servers (*cough*not MW2*cough*) or one with a decent online setup, you’d see the difference.

Dual analog is inherently inferior to mouse + keyboard. Too slow, too imprecise, too unnatural. That link does look like a decent alternative, though.

Switching for friends I can respect. It’s always more fun to screw around with people you know than random strangers.

Well, I use a direct wired connection from my PS3 to my modem, so yeah. ^^;;

And dual analog has just amount of potential as a keyboard and mouse does. The first FPSes were made to be played with controllers; I just think it’s hard for us to make that switch because we’ve been computer gamers for the longest time. I’ve seen some people use dual analogs just as good as those with keyboard and mouse (quick scoping, snapping, 180 snapping, turning, etc.)

I wasn’t talking about your lag. I was talking about the lag of other people (which is generally the problem unless you have a terrible connection).

In regards to K+M vs. dual analog:

1) The first traditional FPS is Wolfenstein 3D. It was released on the PC. Console shooters were 5 years late to the game (the first important one being GoldenEye 007 for the N64).

2) I’m pretty sure the issue is you’ve never seen a real pro at mouse + keyboard. The real issue with dual analog is precision. At high sensitivity, there’s too much variation in an analog stick at any given position (the same input does not always lead to the same output). Mice, with their insanely high DPI, allow for much greater precision and are especially useful for keeping things accurate even at high sensitivity.

You can’t do this with dual analog:

Too many cheaters in PC games, I nearly run into a waller EVERY single match I go to, no matter what FPS I play. (Even paid for ones) If you’d prefer a slightly better controller over fair gameplay, then that’s your choice. Quake is too much of a crazy game, (gravity + speed is as fast as Alien Arena / Cube) and 180 degree snapping is a MAJOR requisite to play the game. I have no problem making the switch from mouse to dual analog, and you KNOW how good I was at Combat Arms. (and CS 1.6)

Watch this video and take your mouse and keyboard with you; I’ve seen players make wonders with a controller that a PC gamer would have just as much as a hard time trying to do the same.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1uspW6kbi4

Who said there are no hackers/glitchers on consoles? They’re on every system, PC, X360, PS3, DS, Wii, etc. Although there aren’t quite as many, they still abound. If Activision was intelligent and allowed dedicated servers, you wouldn’t have hacker issues. I’ve dealt with a hacker twice in three years of playing Valve games.

Watched the video, not bad, but honestly, both of us have done more impressive stuff in CA. It’s a montage. That means it’s a collection of his best play, leaving out the rest. If that’s his best, he’s a great player, but nothing unheard of. The video also highlights the issue with dual analog. Notice how the analog used for aiming isn’t precise enough for subtle adjustments, and he frequently resorts to just moving himself (which moves the crosshair more slowly, making it easier to control). This means moving and shooting becomes very difficult to control because of a lack of precision. At the same time, issues can arise when you need to make a subtle change in aim and you can’t move or lose your cover.

So because of inferior controls, he has to resort to a slower practice for aiming that can sometimes expose him. Moving and making subtle adjustments for their movement is now much more difficult than with a keyboard + mouse. Of course, a great player will still be a great player regardless of the control scheme he’s using because EVERYONE is forced to use that control scheme. However, using an inferior control scheme only cripples gameplay and limits the player in terms of what he can do.

@Nass and Pirkid: All of the above. I had a similar discussion in another forum, and that video was posted. Then I used my 1337 youtube searching skills to find the video again.

Tar if you can find me more than 5 players who hack online in console, then I’ll eat my words. And by this I mean the kind of hacks we see in PC games. (walling, OPK, etc.) NOT trivial things such as modding (terrible trigger, etc.) And what valve game are YOU playing? Do you know the amount of wallers that exist in Source and L4D? Find me a league for any game of Valve’s that doesn’t require an anti-cheat or IGV to be run.

Also, free games such as Combat Arms, Warrock, Soldier Front, Crossfire are practically non-playable now. You NEED to be a waller to play.

Also, can you point out some instances in the movie where he moved himself instead of the crosshair that wasn’t strategic?

One more thing; there are games on the console that don’t restrict who you can connect to, (Lost Planet series) for example, and when you play with oh lets say, Japanese players, you rarely see any lag at all. (This coming from experience. There is very little lag from what I could observe.) However, I could be playing against Canadians in Source and their ping would be over 300. They would be teleporting from freaking bomb sites, for christ’s sake.) And don’t even get me started on the lag of Brazilians that ruined Combat Arms for me. I really love getting shot behind walls.

Okay let’s pretend for a second here that dual analog IS inferior to mouse and keyboard. It really doesn’t matter, because on the console EVERYONE has a dual analog; which would level the playing field. Therefore players would have to deal with the same “crippling process” as others do. There is no B variable, Tar, which would give people a reason to ditch their consoles for a PC. EVERYONE is dealt the same thing, and most players really don’t mind playing with controllers. Same thing on PC, everyone has a mouse and keyboard. It’s just all a matter of perspective. PC gamers would have a hard time adjusting to dual analog where as console gamers would also face the same problem with mouse and keyboards.

My MAIN reason for quitting PC oriented games is because of the cheaters, that’s really it. Otherwise I would’ve loved playing Combat Arms or maybe even CoD4 for the PC. I don’t know about the cheaters in TF2, but I really urge you to play Source for a day and tell me there aren’t any sketchy people. (I know the skill curve for Source is high, but I’m talking about blatant aimbotters that don’t even care about getting banned flashing off their heks) It’s so relieving knowing that the playing field is even while playing on a console, instead of playing as if people can see through walls on the PC.

Also, I’ve really wanted to try my hands on MLG for MW2. It’s all about that prize money, eh? ^_^

I acknowledged everyone’s crippled by the controls in the post you quoted. That’s not the problem. The problem is gameplay in GENERAL suffers as well. If your controls are inferior, that means there’s less you can do, and less gameplay possibilities. This makes for a less interesting, less challenging game in general.

Valve games I almost never have hacker problems in: Source, TF2, and HL2:DM. The reason I don’t never have to deal with them is because the servers are run by fellow players with at least one admin on almost constantly. If a hacker does come in, they’re gone in a minute. Granted, I don’t play competitively in any of those games, but the lengths people will go to hack in a competitive game are incredible, and there’s not a format in existence that can eradicate that sort of thing.

Funny you should mention Japanese players. Japan has one of the most ridiculous fiber networks in the world. You have no lag with them because the server is in the US and data travels to them and back faster than it can to you and back within the same continent. Canada and South America, on the other hand, have sucky networks and thus can lag from relatively small distances. The other issue of course is that a Canadian can set up a server to play with his Canadian friends, and since it doesn’t have to deal with large distances, the server can be reasonably shitty and it’s fine for them. But if a guy from a ways away comes in, he won’t be able to connect. I had this issue with a Russian server, except much worse (lowest my ping got in the minute I was in there was 800). By the way, you live in Cali, right? I’m pretty sure Japan and South America are comparably far away, and certain parts of Eastern Canada might actually be further than Japan.

As for points when aiming with movement wasn’t strategic (which doesn’t make any sense, to be honest, as aiming should ALWAYS be done with the gun and movement for making yourself harder to hit should be done with your legs). Check out 1:27. There are like three kills starting at 1:45 where the guys aren’t even looking his way, and he’s still moving to aim. Moving to aim has a limited speed at which it can be performed (your movement speed), whereas moving the gun to aim can be done as fast as your skill allows. He’s sacrificing precious tenths of a second to move while aiming (don’t try to pretend that little amount of time isn’t important; we both know it’s the difference between a great player and a good player and killing a guy and being killed before you can click). There are also times where he’s using movement to both dodge and aim, like 1:20ish with the guys through the window, which is fine, but they’d be dead faster if he’d move and then aim with the gun. He’d be able to kill two guys in one strafe instead of having to strafe into shooting one, strafe past the other while reloading, and then strafe back to kill the second (or simply make the strafes much smaller, which isn’t really a good idea as you’re pretty easy to hit if the other guy just aims in the middle of your path).

[tarheel91]

xFrozenIdentity said:

tarheel91 said:

Spade said: Welcome! We have a nais friendly community.

Our local druggie Nass will share his latest stories on his psychadelic adventures!

Our very own asian chipmunk Dest1 will attempt to troll VuTales with his chinese insults!

Try not to have an argument with Tarheel, you will lose even if you are right!

So that’s why you haven’t said anything about Mouse + Keyboard vs. Dual Analog. By the way, in that case, you are very, very wrong. I should check recent threads more.

Welcome to Mr. Newcomer. Enjoy your stay. Spade didn’t mention it, but I can also ban your ass, so arguing with me in general isn’t a very good idea. Oh, and you only say “__ years young” if you’re old. Otherwise it’s just weird. If you’re old it’s just cheesy and awkward.

Well lets say I argue with you about … cake. (random i know.) I can get banned for just arguing ? o_O
And … are there any rules to this site ? :O

Nah, you can argue with me. People do so all the time. I’m just saying make me mad and I might abuse my mod powers and send you packing. *wink* *wink*

Rules
We’re pretty laid back. Don’t do anything stupid and nothing will happen. As long as you don’t do anything TOO bad (or continue to do something after we talk to you about it) the most that you’ll get is a warning.

@Spade: That’s why I used that strike through.

[tarheel91]

Spade said:

tarheel91 said:

Spade said:

tarheel91 said:

Spade said:

tarheel91 said: I dunno, dude. Hackers and glitchers exist everywhere, and people are far more likely to have their consoles set up in a far worse place in terms of lag than their computer.

On top of that you’re giving up mouse + keyboard for dual analog? O_o

Trust me, I’m not pulling this out of my ass. The reason I’m switching is because I can actually SEE the difference from when I play at my PC to when I go play PS3 at my friend’s house. Also, I’ll be able to play with my friends more often; none of them are PC gamers.

And yeah, I know. Making the switch to dual analog really gave me the challenge, but it’s really not that bad once you get used to it. If you can get accustomed to a high sensitivity it gives a lot of potential when it comes to sniping and snapping to other people.

If not I can always get this.

I’m just saying, most people have their router set up near their computer while the console is sitting in the living room way away from it. I think the difference you’re seeing is because consoles usually restrict who you can connect to to those within your own country/region whereas on some PC games there’s no restriction on who can play who. Basically, if you’d try a game with dedicated servers (*cough*not MW2*cough*) or one with a decent online setup, you’d see the difference.

Dual analog is inherently inferior to mouse + keyboard. Too slow, too imprecise, too unnatural. That link does look like a decent alternative, though.

Switching for friends I can respect. It’s always more fun to screw around with people you know than random strangers.

Well, I use a direct wired connection from my PS3 to my modem, so yeah. ^^;;

And dual analog has just amount of potential as a keyboard and mouse does. The first FPSes were made to be played with controllers; I just think it’s hard for us to make that switch because we’ve been computer gamers for the longest time. I’ve seen some people use dual analogs just as good as those with keyboard and mouse (quick scoping, snapping, 180 snapping, turning, etc.)

I wasn’t talking about your lag. I was talking about the lag of other people (which is generally the problem unless you have a terrible connection).

In regards to K+M vs. dual analog:

1) The first traditional FPS is Wolfenstein 3D. It was released on the PC. Console shooters were 5 years late to the game (the first important one being GoldenEye 007 for the N64).

2) I’m pretty sure the issue is you’ve never seen a real pro at mouse + keyboard. The real issue with dual analog is precision. At high sensitivity, there’s too much variation in an analog stick at any given position (the same input does not always lead to the same output). Mice, with their insanely high DPI, allow for much greater precision and are especially useful for keeping things accurate even at high sensitivity.

You can’t do this with dual analog:

Too many cheaters in PC games, I nearly run into a waller EVERY single match I go to, no matter what FPS I play. (Even paid for ones) If you’d prefer a slightly better controller over fair gameplay, then that’s your choice. Quake is too much of a crazy game, (gravity + speed is as fast as Alien Arena / Cube) and 180 degree snapping is a MAJOR requisite to play the game. I have no problem making the switch from mouse to dual analog, and you KNOW how good I was at Combat Arms. (and CS 1.6)

Watch this video and take your mouse and keyboard with you; I’ve seen players make wonders with a controller that a PC gamer would have just as much as a hard time trying to do the same.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1uspW6kbi4

Who said there are no hackers/glitchers on consoles? They’re on every system, PC, X360, PS3, DS, Wii, etc. Although there aren’t quite as many, they still abound. If Activision was intelligent and allowed dedicated servers, you wouldn’t have hacker issues. I’ve dealt with a hacker twice in three years of playing Valve games.

Watched the video, not bad, but honestly, both of us have done more impressive stuff in CA. It’s a montage. That means it’s a collection of his best play, leaving out the rest. If that’s his best, he’s a great player, but nothing unheard of. The video also highlights the issue with dual analog. Notice how the analog used for aiming isn’t precise enough for subtle adjustments, and he frequently resorts to just moving himself (which moves the crosshair more slowly, making it easier to control). This means moving and shooting becomes very difficult to control because of a lack of precision. At the same time, issues can arise when you need to make a subtle change in aim and you can’t move or lose your cover.

So because of inferior controls, he has to resort to a slower practice for aiming that can sometimes expose him. Moving and making subtle adjustments for their movement is now much more difficult than with a keyboard + mouse. Of course, a great player will still be a great player regardless of the control scheme he’s using because EVERYONE is forced to use that control scheme. However, using an inferior control scheme only cripples gameplay and limits the player in terms of what he can do.

@Nass and Pirkid: All of the above. I had a similar discussion in another forum, and that video was posted. Then I used my 1337 youtube searching skills to find the video again.

[tarheel91]

Spade said: Welcome! We have a nais friendly community.

Our local druggie Nass will share his latest stories on his psychadelic adventures!

Our very own asian chipmunk Dest1 will attempt to troll VuTales with his chinese insults!

Try not to have an argument with Tarheel, you will lose even if you are right!

So that’s why you haven’t said anything about Mouse + Keyboard vs. Dual Analog. By the way, in that case, you are very, very wrong. I should check recent threads more.

Welcome to Mr. Newcomer. Enjoy your stay. Spade didn’t mention it, but I can also ban your ass, so arguing with me in general isn’t a very good idea. Oh, and you only say “__ years young” if you’re old. Otherwise it’s just weird. If you’re old it’s just cheesy and awkward.

[tarheel91]

MasterCheeze said: Man, dat guy’s hacking.

There’s actually a better video I found once. It’s lost now though. 🙁

[tarheel91]

Spade said:

tarheel91 said:

Spade said:

tarheel91 said: I dunno, dude. Hackers and glitchers exist everywhere, and people are far more likely to have their consoles set up in a far worse place in terms of lag than their computer.

On top of that you’re giving up mouse + keyboard for dual analog? O_o

Trust me, I’m not pulling this out of my ass. The reason I’m switching is because I can actually SEE the difference from when I play at my PC to when I go play PS3 at my friend’s house. Also, I’ll be able to play with my friends more often; none of them are PC gamers.

And yeah, I know. Making the switch to dual analog really gave me the challenge, but it’s really not that bad once you get used to it. If you can get accustomed to a high sensitivity it gives a lot of potential when it comes to sniping and snapping to other people.

If not I can always get this.

I’m just saying, most people have their router set up near their computer while the console is sitting in the living room way away from it. I think the difference you’re seeing is because consoles usually restrict who you can connect to to those within your own country/region whereas on some PC games there’s no restriction on who can play who. Basically, if you’d try a game with dedicated servers (*cough*not MW2*cough*) or one with a decent online setup, you’d see the difference.

Dual analog is inherently inferior to mouse + keyboard. Too slow, too imprecise, too unnatural. That link does look like a decent alternative, though.

Switching for friends I can respect. It’s always more fun to screw around with people you know than random strangers.

Well, I use a direct wired connection from my PS3 to my modem, so yeah. ^^;;

And dual analog has just amount of potential as a keyboard and mouse does. The first FPSes were made to be played with controllers; I just think it’s hard for us to make that switch because we’ve been computer gamers for the longest time. I’ve seen some people use dual analogs just as good as those with keyboard and mouse (quick scoping, snapping, 180 snapping, turning, etc.)

I wasn’t talking about your lag. I was talking about the lag of other people (which is generally the problem unless you have a terrible connection).

In regards to K+M vs. dual analog:

1) The first traditional FPS is Wolfenstein 3D. It was released on the PC. Console shooters were 5 years late to the game (the first important one being GoldenEye 007 for the N64).

2) I’m pretty sure the issue is you’ve never seen a real pro at mouse + keyboard. The real issue with dual analog is precision. At high sensitivity, there’s too much variation in an analog stick at any given position (the same input does not always lead to the same output). Mice, with their insanely high DPI, allow for much greater precision and are especially useful for keeping things accurate even at high sensitivity.

You can’t do this with dual analog:

[tarheel91]

Spade said:

tarheel91 said: I dunno, dude. Hackers and glitchers exist everywhere, and people are far more likely to have their consoles set up in a far worse place in terms of lag than their computer.

On top of that you’re giving up mouse + keyboard for dual analog? O_o

Trust me, I’m not pulling this out of my ass. The reason I’m switching is because I can actually SEE the difference from when I play at my PC to when I go play PS3 at my friend’s house. Also, I’ll be able to play with my friends more often; none of them are PC gamers.

And yeah, I know. Making the switch to dual analog really gave me the challenge, but it’s really not that bad once you get used to it. If you can get accustomed to a high sensitivity it gives a lot of potential when it comes to sniping and snapping to other people.

If not I can always get this.

I’m just saying, most people have their router set up near their computer while the console is sitting in the living room way away from it. I think the difference you’re seeing is because consoles usually restrict who you can connect to to those within your own country/region whereas on some PC games there’s no restriction on who can play who. Basically, if you’d try a game with dedicated servers (*cough*not MW2*cough*) or one with a decent online setup, you’d see the difference.

Dual analog is inherently inferior to mouse + keyboard. Too slow, too imprecise, too unnatural. That link does look like a decent alternative, though.

Switching for friends I can respect. It’s always more fun to screw around with people you know than random strangers.

[tarheel91]

I dunno, dude. Hackers and glitchers exist everywhere, and people are far more likely to have their consoles set up in a far worse place in terms of lag than their computer.

On top of that you’re giving up mouse + keyboard for dual analog? O_o

[tarheel91]

You’re not missing much, ha. Just a bunch of spam trying out different features.

[tarheel91]

Pirkid said:

David said: hhaaa the clouds look like coton candyy hehee..

yknow imma copy DJ and just type like him lmaoo.. he has the weirdest typing mech ever hahahha… like we got perfect score rite and hes like we’ll all be perf and shizz… hahahaaaa

but yeahh loner is down in beantown smokin his weed hahaha

We’ve lost another one, men

You’re pretty easily fooled.

[tarheel91]

Lithium said: Know what zombie scared the shit out of me, even though I had a shotgun, crossbow, and rocket launcher?
This asshole.

Don’t even get me started on Howlers. Ravenholm is the creepiest level in any game I’ve ever played. Those things flew at you like fucking blurs and took 2 direct hits from a shotty. Then you had the howler headcrabs that sometimes survived. You never noticed them because you have 3 or 4 super zombies trying to rip your head off, and the stupid headcrab would temporarily bring you down to 1 HP while you’re fighting for your life. FUCK RAVENHOLM.

Here’s my fragment from a long time ago: I’m at Ravenholm in HL2. I’ve never been so freaked out in my life.

[tarheel91]

DarkDragoon said:

tarheel91 said:

DarkDragoon said: I see we has a challenger ^^^

Yours looks shinier than mine, and it has a side wheel scroller, so it’s probably better. However, I can adjust my mouse’s sensitivity on the fly. Comes in great for switching between Assault and Sniper in FPSs.

I have the mouse sensitivity switched as well…mainly use for when i’m screwing around sniping as I usually go full sensitivity no matter what.
;D
@Davey BUT ITS SO NICE THO, AMIRITE?

Mine has buttons to change sensitivity above and below the scroll wheel. I didn’t see those on yours. O_o

[tarheel91]

DarkDragoon said: I see we has a challenger ^^^

Yours looks shinier than mine, and it has a side wheel scroller, so it’s probably better. However, I can adjust my mouse’s sensitivity on the fly. Comes in great for switching between Assault and Sniper in FPSs.

[Author]

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